When this work first came into the collection it was recorded as by Guercino. Later it was reattributed to a follower of Guercino and was assumed to be a copy of a late 17th century Italian altarpiece. Their records make no reference to Luca Giordano's "Virgin and Child with Souls in Purgatory" in San Pietro di Castello.

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No one can see the painting until the collection re-opens, but there is no harm in inviting comments in the meantime.

It is obviously a version of the Giordano in Venice, but it is missing the top with the angels crowning Mary.

It does not appear to be from the hand of Giordano. The composition follows the San Pietro di Castello painting very closely and appears to be a copy of it. Better photos would be useful nonetheless.

Whilst it is true that the Salford painting clearly follows the San Pietro di Castello painting quite faithfully (in the Salford painting, I would even suggest that the top register was cut out, and the fragmented putti overpainted...), one cannot rule out Giordano's authorship on the basis of the image we have, or even confirm it. However, for the time being, I would rule out that it's a mere copy by a follower on the basis of the fact that it is purely in the style of Giordano. Usually, copies would take on the flavour of the city in which the original sits - and in this I can't see any Venetian elements. It's either by Giordano or his workshop. A good cleaning will tell.

For the time being, we need to wait for at least better images.

We are aware of multiple versions of works by Luca Giordano. The work looks better than a studio copy; the image is not well readable and too weak for a sensible opinion. In any way, when the painting would be well photographed, I would involve Giuseppe Scavizzi in such a debate.

Thank you for sharing your insight on this painting! It has great potential to be a major work by Giordano, and it would be unfortunate if it remains in its current condition for any longer, even if it ultimately results to be by his workshop.

There is another painting on this Art Uk website that merits your opinion if you have the time. Could you have a look? At first I thought it was by Preti early 1650s, but then I began to see Bolognese elements, so I suggested Savolini... I'm probably wrong, but whatever it is it's a painting of the highest level. https://www.artuk.org/artdetective/pending-approval/st-john-the-baptist/page/1

The link to the St John appears to be broken. Here are some other links below:

https://www.yorkmuseumstrust.org.uk/collections/search/item/?id=20000232&search_query=bGltaXQ9MTYmc2VhcmNoX3RleHQ9YmFwdGlzdCZDTCU1QjAlNUQ9RmluZStBcnQmR3MlNUJvcGVyYXRvciU1RD0lM0UlM0QmR3MlNUJ2YWx1ZSU1RD0mR2UlNUJvcGVyYXRvciU1RD0lM0MlM0QmR2UlNUJ2YWx1ZSU1RD0mRk49

https://vads.ac.uk/large.php?uid=244175&sos=1

Despite my initial reservations, I agree with Riccardo and Nicholas. The current photo (and condition of the painting) is not doing the work any favours. It is not possible to get a good read of it at present, and nothing should be ruled out without better images and more research. There does appear to be some quality and, as noted, multiple copies by Giordano (and or workshop) are not uncommon. Guiseppe Scavizzi and Andrés Úbeda de los Cobos should ultimately be consulted.

While we wait for better photos, I attach a comparison of the Salford image (edited) and that of the San Pietro di Castello version.

As a side note, the St. John the Baptist at York Art Gallery is excellent and certainly deserves further research.

Given that this could be an important picture, the collection should be asked for better photos so the matter can be pursued further, as it was never actually contacted due to the pandemic situation.

At a minimum, the title should be corrected and the connection to Giordano noted, such as "by or after Luca Giordano" or a note.

As Nicholas De Gaetano says (28/04/2020), the painting is "either by Giordano or his workshop. A good cleaning will tell." In the picture's current state, I doubt if asking for a better photo is the answer, it's about cleaning the picture and it's not obvious that Salford is going to be able to do this any time soon.

As such, as Jacinto says in the previous post, the title should be corrected ("Virgin and Child with Souls in Purgatory") and the connection to Giordano noted, such as "by or after Luca Giordano". On that basis I suggest that it may be wise to close this discussion.

Once appropriate changes are made to the Art UK entry, it might help to give some publicity to this picture to see if funds for restoration could be obtained. Even if this is only studio of Giordano, it would be a significant picture for a British collection outside of London.

I recommend to the ArtUK panel that Salford Art Gallery should attribute the painting to Luca Giordano (1634-1705) or his workshop, and that it should be identified as being a copy, omitting the crowning cherubs in the heavens, after Giordano’s 'Virgin and Child with Souls in Purgatory' in the Vendramin chapel of the church in San Pietro di Castello, Venice, as was first suggested by Nicholas de Gaetano in his posting of 28 April 2020. Whether Salford’s painting was originally painted without the crowning cherubs, or whether these were removed later, could only be confirmed once the canvas was cleaned and the painting assessed technically.